From shonk to.......

[BenH]

Re: From shonk to.......

Started to clean up and get ready to weld, found another crack Think I'll have to chop out some of the lower bulkhead for a proper look..


Red Astra by ben a.k.a me, on Flickr

So with a bit of grinding time to start thinking about how to brace it all up..


I'll add spreader plate's where the box section meets the chassis, thinking 25mm x3mm as that's what I have to hand.. So one bit side to side at the base of the lower bulkhead, large plate over the rear wishbone mount, then that goes up and out to the chassis leg, then a couple of diagonal bits to brace it all up..

Red Astra by ben a.k.a me, on Flickr

Next up, group A type plate inside the bay from chassis rail up to strut top, then along the of the wing area thinking of cutting a 60 x 40 to a pair of C section one for each side. Then welding in to extend the brace to the end of the strut top

Then maybe add something in down the A pillar, just not sure on this one as the A pillar does not feel too thick and it's bad practice to brace into a flat plate center..

Red Astra by ben a.k.a me, on Flickr

Any thoughts or other ideas?

[BenH]

Re: From shonk to.......

Before I forget I have a plan for the upper bulkhead as well, but need to rough it out first and make sure. But in short cut a plate to go over the hole for the pedal box in 2mm thick running down to lower bulkhead and up on to the return. That will get stitched in then the steering rack mount can go back on after being repaired and improved. Then add some box section in side to side as Blackbox has done..

[DarrenH]

Re: From shonk to.......

i've got pictures in my archive of inner wheel arches starting at the kadett B running through to mk5 astra. one thing that gets bigger every incarnation is the triangulation between the A pillar and upper chassis rail (or insert pressing/construction which forms the suspension turret) so i think you are on to a winner with your ideas

ok so the kadett B and C were rear wheel drive and double wishbone so not a direct paralell to be drawn, but still.

[Steve Heley]

Re: From shonk to.......

Here's something similar to what you are looking with the lower bulkhead..

[BenH]

Re: From shonk to.......

i've got pictures in my archive of inner wheel arches starting at the kadett B running through to mk5 astra. one thing that gets bigger every incarnation is the triangulation between the A pillar and upper chassis rail (or insert pressing/construction which forms the suspension turret) so i think you are on to a winner with your ideas

ok so the kadett B and C were rear wheel drive and double wishbone so not a direct paralell to be drawn, but still.

Interesting Have you got the pics of the mk4 or 5 to hand?

Here's something similar to what you are looking with the lower bulkhead..

Another interesting idea, what car is that in?

[Steve Heley]

Re: From shonk to.......

I think it's a Pug 106?

[BlackBox]

Re: From shonk to.......

On mine the area of the top patch was well shot .. so a good idea to brace there I believe. I couldn't see any probs in the other two areas and considering how rotten/stresses my car was before the rebuild I decided these in this instance didn't need any help.

Started to clean up and get ready to weld, found another crack Think I'll have to chop out some of the lower bulkhead for a proper look..


Red Astra by ben a.k.a me, on Flickr

So with a bit of grinding time to start thinking about how to brace it all up..


I'll add spreader plate's where the box section meets the chassis, thinking 25mm x3mm as that's what I have to hand.. So one bit side to side at the base of the lower bulkhead, large plate over the rear wishbone mount, then that goes up and out to the chassis leg, then a couple of diagonal bits to brace it all up..

Red Astra by ben a.k.a me, on Flickr

Next up, group A type plate inside the bay from chassis rail up to strut top, then along the of the wing area thinking of cutting a 60 x 40 to a pair of C section one for each side. Then welding in to extend the brace to the end of the strut top

Then maybe add something in down the A pillar, just not sure on this one as the A pillar does not feel too thick and it's bad practice to brace into a flat plate center..

Red Astra by ben a.k.a me, on Flickr

Any thoughts or other ideas?

[BlackBox]

Re: From shonk to.......

Sorry Ben I can't edit my last post, I'm talking about the last picture.

[BlackBox]

Re: From shonk to.......

Then add some box section in side to side as Blackbox has done..

It's till holding, no cracks yet, prob 4k hard road miles ... it did make the steering feel more positive which is a bonus.

I now wishes I'd moved the front turrets like you are about to do, up and back .. good progress there

[Vinci]

Re: From shonk to.......

I see a resemblence...



Can't comment much on the effectiveness of the A-pillar brace, and I did also notice it was bracing in to a very thin area, which I had planned to place a larger plate on first, but turned out a lot smaller than I had liked/planned.... Oh well...

As for this plan:


I am not so sure if that's all that effective, this area usually cracks because:
A. there is monstrous force applied to it while braking
B. some spotwelds are already gone through rust

I suppose it will be much more effective to brace it further up the 'lever' and that's a lower 'strutbrace' that connects the front wishbone pivot points.

[DarrenH]

Re: From shonk to.......

ben concern about bracing to a single point on the flat A pillar is valid though, like you have done vinci

heres mk3 and mk4 inner arches

[DarrenH]

Re: From shonk to.......

mk4 looks like continuous panel from the A pillar tbh, ontop of it being wider at the A pillar end

triangulation from bulkhead to strut tops too

[BenH]

Re: From shonk to.......

Cheers all

Thanks for the pics Mr H, certainly gives me some ideas there..

BB Yeah I think adding in the Group A brace from chassis rail to strut top is handy, more for the fact I've chopped them off cant hurt to have a little more there?

Vinci, Yeah I know what you mean about the crack, I was planning to do this before I found the crack that's just another repair to add to the list. I too think it's down to the spot welds rusting, so I'll have a good investigation in that area and strip out then stich weld the whole lot to be sure..


I do think though feeling how well that area can move under load from my hand some bracing inside is needed, yeah some is needed outside in the bay too and I'm planning for that too. But until I get a F23 in the bay I don't want to plan too much, but I'm also thinking having the area braced inside will help me to have a place to brace the outside too. Just trying to keep it all triangulated as best as I can.

I don't really want to go down the route of a lower strut brace type thing and lose ground clearance, just tie it back into that main under floor brace somehow perhaps..

[Vinci]

Re: From shonk to.......

I'm quite happy with my welded in lower brace, which also enables Vectra rear gearbox mount fitting.... Doesn't compromise ground clearance too, and all the bits fitted around it without fouling it either, except the exhaust perhaps, but that's easy enough to change...

And the Group A reinforcement to the turrets, I'm not always too pleased about tin laminated areas as they tend to rust and once there is a hole and moisture enters there's no stopping it. Therefore I diagonally cut through a box section to get two triangular box sections that I welded on top after fitting the turrets. These are welded all around except a tiny bit at the bottom back, to enable any moisture to leave the cavity, and to enable waxing the inside of it.... These add a massive amount of stiffness, and with turrets moved back the holes for the tie rods are more under them. And since they are THE place carrying the whole front end weight I saw it as a necessity to add more strength there...

[BenH]

Re: From shonk to.......

Ah I forgot about your lower brace, will see when I get a F23 how much room there is. I think the box it self is quite a lot bigger..

That box up the inner wings seems a good idea, like you say laminating can lead to rust problems.. What's the clearance like around the alternator pulley?